The comments here ought to be fun. What a shitshow we have made of this planet.
Netanyahu is very friendly with Putin. I don’t know if I would trust that gift personally.
So US gives free weapons to Israel and they sell to Ukraine got it
Anyone who gets into bed with Israel is irredeemably corrupt.
Shaking hands with a war criminal and a country involved in a genocide, also supporting said country?
Fuck off.
What do you expect Zelensky to do?
This sort of attitude is why the left doesn’t win in the west (not to mention full on tankie degeneracy, which I am not accusing you of).
So, when Ukraine is pointing out genocide from Russia (which is levels lower than the other one), they are actually saying that genocide is bad only because it’s against them, but fine when it suits them.
This is false. No one ever said anything like that. Nor are the actions done by Ukraine (or even Ukrainian society) aligned with this worldview.
The “lower level” comment is inappropriate and shows your ignorance of history.
For such a wild bullshit as they are posting, you can safely assume they are a Russian meant to sew discord
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Whatever word you’re using to describe them, it’s Russian, Russia has vested interest in dividing Americans against each other in every online space that they know of, side effect of not having a new leader. Every four years is Russia could mobilize against America completely and consistently using manipulation online there’s so much information out there on the Internet about Russia is doing you just have to look for it and be curious.
Americans are doing pretty good job dividing against each other even without Russia.
Yeah, everybody who doesn’t align with your view has to be a Russian.
Yes, 100% yes. Also, I’m done you
We’ll see when there are votes in UN and other bodies about Israel. I’m sure Ukraine strongly condemns Israeli genocide, as much as when they were saying not so long ago they are in the same position as Israel. One has to be extremely naïve thinking those Patriots come without strings attached.
So what are those strings? I am not saying there are or aren’t, but surely you have to be specific if you are making such claims.
Initially there was a strong level of public support for Israel because people in Ukraine saw similarities between the behaviour of Hamas and the russians (summary killings, rape, internment or civilians). Once people in Ukraine saw what Israel did to Gaza attitudes started to change.
The government and Zelenskyy can’t stand Netanyahu because he is pretty friendly with putin. You’re not on great terms with someone who is meeting with your enemy (that has tried to get you killed several times).
You do understand that Ukraine requested the Israeli Patriots as far back as October 2022, right?
Here is one example of those strings, I have no doubts there are and will be more. https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/09/1154496
As per asking me to tell you what exactly are those strings is kinda funny, isn’t it?
Why is it funny? This thread is littered with random musings and most posters aggressively refuse to refer to specifics. And generally have a comically impractical take on the issue.
What you brought up is a solid point, Ukraine abstained when it should have voted in favour (I say this as someone who votes in Ukrainian elections, pay taxes, donates etc.).
Is that it? So Ukraine voting in favour (or against Israel) would stop the killing in Gaza?
What would change if Ukraine voted for (which I would have preferred) in the Oct 2024 General Assembly vote?
I guess the British colonialists should’ve said no to the French by that standard. War is nuanced, and survival doesn’t make us picky.
But what if your survival means a genocide of another population?
How is Ukraine’s acceptance of older Patriot systems from Israel a genocide of the Palestinians?
Ridiculous logic.
I’ve been an outraged and outspoken supporter of Ukraine since before they were invaded. But, this is fucked. Zelensky can get all-the-way fucked if he’s going to ally with the war criminals like this.
How is Zelenskyy allying with Netanyahu?
We are getting their older Patriot systems (that are very much needed, you’ll change your tune when the building across the street from you gets hit with a Shahed), what do you expect Zelenskyy to do, say “No!”?
I will speculate Zelenskyy’s opinion of Netanyahu is far closer to your own, but unless you are willing to provide x8 Patriot missile systems, you are not in a position to judge.
Are you suggesting that Israel is getting nothing in return for this? At a bare minimum, Israel is purchasing support for their bloodthirsty expansionist project. Sorry, but I do expect Ukraine to say no. I don’t care what Zelensky’s (or any other leader’s) personal opinion is about anything. The only thing that matters is their actions. Providing even passive support for evil, like that personified by Israel, makes it more likely that nations will behave the way that Russia has against Ukraine. Find another way.
What is Israel getting in return from Ukraine for the Patriot system? Cite your sources.
What do you mean by “support for their bloodthirsty expansionist project”? Be specific.
What do you mean by providing passive support? What passive support is being providing? Zelenskyy shaking hands with Netenyahu? Him not shaking hands with Netenyahu will force Israel to killing civilians in Gaza?
I’ve been up for 3 hour since ~ 6 am because of today’s attack by the russians (after waking up twice due to Shaheds and then a Kinzhal ballistic missile warning). You believe we should not be able counter russian bombings? Just say “No!” to additional air defense systems? Do you even think about what you are writing?
How is refusal to accept the Patriot systems going to help the Palestinians?
Find another way? What does that mean? Be clear and specific!
Your have a wrapped and almost comically impractical view of the world. I can guarantee you, this type of attitude is not going to help stop the current horrors happening in Gaza and the broader genocidal imperialism of Israel.
No, they don’t think about what they’re posting because they live in the safety of a place not under constant attack and genocide OR because they are themselves a Russian troll trying to stoke fights. The third option is they are an unempathetic fuckwit with such privilege of safety that they cannot comprehend that shades of grey exist and survival can mean doing things you may not necessarily want to do.
They are lord farquaad levels of “some of you may die, but it’s a sacrifice I’m willing to take”. Obviously a troll or someone who should not be taken even a little bit seriously.
Any port in a storm to protect your people, it’s the indecisiveness of the US support thats done this.
Israel’s done it to piss people off it’s politics. The US could have set this up an iron dome system n Ukraine years ago.
I reject his. You’re about a half step away from articulating the rationale that Russia has used to justify its invasion of Ukraine. It’s wrong.
Accepting Patriot missiles to protect your skies is akin to organising a genocidal imperialist invasion?
Allying with a genocidal nation is a form of support for that nation and it’s genocidal project. I don’t understand why this is so difficult to accept. Or, are you taking the stance that the ends always justify the means when it comes to defense. If so, then you’re taking a stance that has been used by Hamas to justify 10/7, Israel to justify genocide, and Russia to justify invading Ukraine.
No, you are wrong.
You bring up all this flowery rhetoric and random accusations, yet when push comes to shove, you always hide from specifics.
What do you mean by allying?
How would Ukraine not accepting the Patriot systems help the Palestinians?
Be clear and specific.
Allying - to have friendly relations, to help each other, to cooperate, etc.
Is Israel being friendly, helping and cooperating with Ukraine? Yes.
Is Ukraine being friendly with Israel? Yes. Is Ukraine cooperating with Israel? Yes. Is Ukraine helping Israel? To the extent that we know what happening, they are at least lending legitimacy to the Israeli regime. That helps them given that they are facing mounting international pressure, ICJ charges, and cratering public support. The agreement also implies that Ukraine will owe something to Israel at some point. That amounts to a promise to help them, somehow. It’s also very reasonable to speculate that Israel has some repayment arranged behind the scenes, although we can only speculate at this point.
Am I holding Ukraine to a high moral standard? Yes. I appreciate the desperate and immediate danger to Ukraine, but this is the same standard that Ukraine and specifically Zelensky have been demanding from the international community since this started. He has rightly appealed to people’s morality and basic human sense of justice as the reason for supplying Ukraine’s defense. Working directly with a regime as comically evil, as outrageously violent, and destructive as Israel undermines all of that.
If you’re in the United States, there’s a non-0 chance you didn’t vote for Kamala because of whatever bullshit Stance you have
Even in September 2025 your still saying shit like this? Kamala, Biden, Obama are the same establishment as trump, Bush and Reagan. You have to genuinely stupid if you think Kamala would have ended the genocide and saved Ukraine
Did you get enough gruel, are they going to send you back to the Gulag, if you don’t post enough
I literally cannot understand whatever you are trying to say here.
Israel is a logical ally to Ukraine because both are being attacked by an evil entity using fake justification. The more nations are acting both against Russia and radical Islam, the better. To have a nation as advanced as Israel on the right side on this is a very good thing.
This is the most illogical and ahistorical shit I’ve read all day. The only way you can frame the genocide of the Palestinians as defense against an evil entity is if you want to arbitrarily start history at a point decades after Israel began killing and displacing millions of people. That’s the same sort of intellectual dishonesty that Russia has used to fabricate historical rationalizations for their invasion.
Yeah, them being pissed at Russia and then backing the Middle Eastern equivalent of Russia is some serious cognitive dissonance shit
That country is providing them with air defense missiles, so… (yes, it’s a shit situation)
millions of people
Where did you source this data? Based on mainstream sources (UN, OCHA, B’Tselem) the number of Arabs displaced from modern day Israel/former territories of Mandatory Palestine from '47 until 2025 are between 995 - 1’105’000 and the number of casualties 67 - 105’000.
As a comparison, the number of Jews displaced from Arab countries during the same period number somewhere between 800-900’000.
Here’s the Lancet with a conservative estimate of 186,000 (7.9% of the population) between Oct '23 and May '24, obviously this figure will be higher by now.
It’s very difficult to count, because non-Palestinian journalists aren’t allowed to enter, and Palestinian journalists aren’t allowed to continue being alive.Here’s the Lancet with a conservative estimate of 186,000 (7.9% of the population) between Oct '23 and May '24, obviously this figure will be higher by now.
It’s very difficult to count, because non-Palestinian journalists aren’t allowed to enter, and Palestinian journalists aren’t allowed to continue being alive.Edit to add, because I just reread this: comparing Jews displaced from Arab countries to Palestinians displaced by Israel is frankly, fucking base racism — simultaneously antisemitic and islamophobic. If I wasn’t so disgusted I’d be impressed.
Interesting although contentious letter detailing an estimate of potential indirect conflict deaths (it includes potential future deaths).
However, it seems rather simplistic and/or flawed. They simply multiply the casualties Hamas have reported by a “conservative” x4 multiplier which then gives their number. The multiplier comes from this publication and states that most of the casualties are “indirect and caused mainly by preventable infectious diseases, malnutrition, and neonatal- and pregnancy-related conditions that emerged in the resource-poor post-conflict environment.” - which means that this number includes post-conflict casualties that have not yet happened and are preventable. Furthermore, the base number already includes a lot of indirect civilian deaths, and unlike the other conflicts that the x4 multiplier comes from is heavily reported on and followed by media/authorities.
This article from Die Welte is more recent and examines a more robust study.
Still, even if we took the estimate provided by the Lancet here at face value, OP’s claim of “millions of people” looks like absurd misinfo to me.
You’re entitled to your opinion on the matter of course. And the saddest realisation is that because of the industrial scale of the killings, human lives are a rounding error and we will never know the true number.
It looks like about 140000 Palestinians killed between 1948 and 2023, with about 40000 more confirmed since 2023. My source is the Palestinian Central Bureau for Statistics.
In addition to that, millions (yes millions) of Palestinians have been displaced, including two million since 07.10.2023.
So when op said:
killing and displacing millions of people.
They were 100% correct, in fact. There is not a shred of absurdity in this claim, and it can’t be considered misinformation.
That is a facinating take the active genocide taking place in Gaza, carried out by Israel.
Israel isn’t sending it because they’re nice. They’re sending it because it’s a 30 year old system and they want new equipment. And it also makes them look slightly better. Though it would be difficult to look any worse for them.
Are you talking about nazi “state” of israel? They’re one of the r asons for radical islam. Them and fucking USA. And brittish colonial past.
