Is that significant? I am too lazy to do the math, but 6 tons of urine at 37 temperature while cooling to whatever temperatures are there, could free 4kJ * 6k * 40 ~= 1GJ ~= 300 kW*h. Which is pathetically low in the scale of the mountain.
quick math tells me that if we include urea (0.85M) and salt (0.71M) then freezing point of urine should be about -4.2C, in close to worst case scenario, which decreases roughly linearly as it is diluted. meaning that this is temperature where urine starts freezing, but below that point there is some amount of liquid where all urea and salt concentrates. just for water-salt mix some amount of liquid will remain down to -22C
i guess this gets more important at higher tempetatures
Well, i thought a little about it (30s). On the common trails they all use and pee on, say the extra stuff gets trapped under the layers, adds some slush along the way. As they trop all over it back and forth, is there a chance it starts jiggling and sliding?
Wouldnt 6 thousand liters of urine a day roughly melt 6 thousand liters of ice a day just in areas concentrated around the base camps if the ice isn’t colder than -37C?
And the title aside, I think the article mentioned the study included lots of heat sources, with urine being a smaller part.
I’d say with enough pee on the same spot(s), there is a fair chance that some ice will start sliding, turning into a problem a few kilometres below but I have no scientific foundation to back it.
Is that significant? I am too lazy to do the math, but 6 tons of urine at 37 temperature while cooling to whatever temperatures are there, could free 4kJ * 6k * 40 ~= 1GJ ~= 300 kW*h. Which is pathetically low in the scale of the mountain.
I do no math, isn’t this about a lower freezing point for water due to the extra chemicals?
quick math tells me that if we include urea (0.85M) and salt (0.71M) then freezing point of urine should be about -4.2C, in close to worst case scenario, which decreases roughly linearly as it is diluted. meaning that this is temperature where urine starts freezing, but below that point there is some amount of liquid where all urea and salt concentrates. just for water-salt mix some amount of liquid will remain down to -22C
i guess this gets more important at higher tempetatures
I believe that effect would be even less noticeable.
Well, i thought a little about it (30s). On the common trails they all use and pee on, say the extra stuff gets trapped under the layers, adds some slush along the way. As they trop all over it back and forth, is there a chance it starts jiggling and sliding?
This actually made my day. Together with all the other posts here speculating whithout having any idea what they are talking about.
I can suspect a chance of yellowing, but that’s it :)
Wouldnt 6 thousand liters of urine a day roughly melt 6 thousand liters of ice a day just in areas concentrated around the base camps if the ice isn’t colder than -37C?
And the title aside, I think the article mentioned the study included lots of heat sources, with urine being a smaller part.
Not exactly. The specific heat of ice is about half of the specific heat of water.
So 6 tonnes of urine at 37°C would take 12 tonnes of ice from -37°C to 0°C.
That’s still ice, though, and it takes way more energy to thaw ice that to warm ice from -37 to 0.
Actually, I’ll just do the math.
6 Mg piss * 37°C * 4.18 J/g°C = 929 MJ
Let’s say ambient ice temp is -20°C.
20°C * 2.05 J/g°C * X + 333.55 J/g * X = 929 MJ
X ~2.5 tonnes of ice melted.
Not too bad. I suspect the change in albedo is the real problem.
I’m pretty sure you can cause avalanches if you yell too loud.
What about a fart? I always fart when I pee.
A stampede of mountaineers suddenly running from you could be a problem, true.
I’d say with enough pee on the same spot(s), there is a fair chance that some ice will start sliding, turning into a problem a few kilometres below but I have no scientific foundation to back it.
Starts doing the math.
Love it.