Google getting rid of all the things that made people want an android phone over an iPhone.
Yep, if this happens there is no benefit to android.
It’s still a step up from iOS, which has had similar restrictions since they started.
Apple allows sideloading (somewhat), this is would be demonstrably worse (if enacted)
somewhat
Yes. Only in the EU and only since 2024 when Apple was forced to do it by new laws. It’s reasonable to assume Google would be subject to the same laws.
If you live outside if the EU, it’s “no sideload for you!” There are computer programs that can do sideloading to iPhones, but they have limitations, like having to refresh the sideloaded apps every seven days.
Wholly incorrect. You’re allowed to sideload up to 3 apps (or 10 appIDs, whichever comes first) without being a developer, and that arbitrary restriction is removed if you pay for a dev license, regardless of which part of the world you’re in.
In the EU you’re allowed to install third party app stores (still have to be notarized by Apple) which isn’t sideloading
The limitations depend on which program you’re using - there’s more than one - which is why I only gave a simple example. And if you have to pay for a function that is otherwise free to many others, that’s a limitation.
Side loading is installing an app from anywhere but the official store. So by definition “third party” is side loading. Whether it’s another store or authorised is irrelevant.
The limitations depend on which program you’re using - there’s more than one - which is why I only gave a simple example.
No it doesn’t. It’s in all the documentation, official and otherwise
Side loading is installing an app from anywhere but the official store. So by definition “third party” is side loading. Whether it’s another store or authorised is irrelevant.
You can’t just make up a definition, believe it, and then share it like it’s true. We’re going by the legal definition as that’s the only one that matters.
Apple only allows up to 3 apps or 10 appIDs to be sideloaded, wherever you are in the world. Period.
“This ad company restricting anything you can load is better than iOS” is decently a thing you can say hahahaha
Whatever things made people get into Android some 20 years ago are no longer relevant to the majority of people.
The biggest benefit will remain the apps. People love apps. In that regard, their only competition is Apple. It’s why no one can make a new phone OS.
The other reason is cost. If you want a cheap device, Apple has no such thing. There are hundreds of Android devices you can buy for a couple hundred dollars.
For those who buy Samsung flagships for more than an iPhone, well those people I can’t explain.
I can see apps becoming less important over time. PWAs were basically what Apple originally planed for the smartphone anyway and now they are capable of damn near anything you would want an app to do. No store to rely on. No updates to install. No storage space being eaten into. The browser engine functions as a layer of abstraction between the scary untrusted app and your own OS. It’s kinda perfect.
You might think so but PWAs have been around for a long time and seen very little adoption.
They haven’t been promoted or supported well until fairly recently. Also, Firefox is not compatible with PWAs but chrome, edge, and safari are.
They’ve been well-supported for many years.
Open Firefox and pin a PWA. I’ll wait.
Do you mean pin as in creating a shortcut to the webapp on the homescreen/launcher?
Wait for what? I’ve done this many times.
Linux phones are moving fast but it feels like Android is moving faster on the other direction 😥
(Yes I know Android is built over Linux, I mean more traditional and open distros like postmarketos)
Unfortunately, that is 0.1% of their global market that is affected. So, they don’t really have much to lose.
Yup my first thought was “Where is your God now?”
Google ditched “Don’t be evil” a long time ago.
Remember that brief period in the US where, for a fleeting moment, Lina Khan went after a few companies for monopolistic practices?
Yeah man, those were the days.
Brother let me tell you about my friend Janet Reno, who fucked with Microsoft in 2001…
Meanwhile, back at the ranch
Malware-ridden apps made it into Google’s Play Store, scored 19 million downloads
https://www.theregister.com/2025/08/26/apps_android_malware/
Google can’t keep malware off the platform now, but sure, make it mandatory you can’t go anywhere else unless they say so first.
How about letting the users decide what to sideload? What the hell?
I hope the EU is ready to also sue Google.
The EU is currently deepthroating Trump so hard that it’s completely out of breath and all our clothes are ruined.
With how volatile Trump is this could change literally anyday, but with the current political equilibrium all google would have to do is gift trump a shiny golden thing so he makes a threatening remark about gas exports and the EU would go “uwu yes master right away master, do you want to fuck my gaping asshole while you’re at it?”.
It will probably be for the rest of the world.
EU devices not effected.
Google says it’s no different than checking IDs at the airport.
Fucker, if I own the airport, own the planes in the airport, am the only person using my own planes in my own airport, then nobody is asking for my ID.
Our phone, our software choice.
Fucker, if I own the airport, own the planes in the airport, am the only person using my own planes in my own airport, then nobody is asking for my ID.
Okay, but what if Google owns the airport, the planes, and thinks it’s entitled to own the people flying on them, to boot?
Our phone, our software choice.
There it is, haha.
Gave me a good chuckle as i’m with you here.
I have a similar sentiment when it comes to ads, my device, i pay for the internet and the device is inside my home. I’ll decide if you get to show me ads.
For ads at least the argument can be made that the content you consume is not yours and as such you should not be allowed to choose how it is monetized.
Google unilaterally deciding this is like Firefox or chrome adding ads to websites. Which is like no… They’re the medium through which content is consumed.
Read the contracts you sign when you buy your phone and you’ll understand how wrong you are. The problem here is we have very little choices. Monopolies kill consumer choice.
99% of those contracts are not enforceable. And I bought my phone used. No paper, no contract.
Read the contracts you sign when you buy your phone
Contracts? Unless I’m buying a subsidized phone where a mobile phone plan is required, I’m not sure what other contract I’d be signing. I never got one from Samsung, OnePlus, Google, any used marketplace, or Amazon.
They get paid, and I get hardware to do what I like with it. If I can’t do what I want with it, then I’m renting, and I should be paying a rental fee, not a “full price”.
Good for you, you are the 1%
I didn’t sign a contract. Also just flashed the Pixel to GrapheneOS, and bye bye google
Wasn’t Apple sued for not allowing sideloading?
Oof, time to bite the bullet and switch email providers. Shit like this is why I’ve spent the last couple years de-googling my life.
Two things especially worth noting from the article.
If you have a non-Google build of Android on your phone, none of this applies.
This means that at least GrapheneOS will be unaffected for now. Other ROMs without gapps will be unaffected only as long as you don’t install gapps. Since Graphene has a sandbox for them, I’m assuming it’ll be fine. That is, unless Google decides to lock the bootloader entirely.
In September 2026, Google plans to launch this feature in Brazil, Indonesia, Singapore, and Thailand. The next step is still hazy, but Google is targeting 2027 to expand the verification requirements globally.
So most users worldwide still have at least 1.5 years until it’s implemented. Plenty of time to get a Pixel and install Graphene on it. Or to figure out some other plan.
Don’t get me wrong - this is insane, unreasonable and horrible news for everyone. We should push back as hard as physically possible against it. However, at the very least we still have some time to figure things out before the policy rolls out.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Google stop allowing BL unlocking soon… Following Samsung and Xiaomi (although Xiaomi technically can be unlocked, in reality you’ll not be able to do so nowadays unless you pay someone to do it via remote USB shit for you)
The Android ecosystem has been feeling more like an invasive chaotic advertisement machine the past few years. The play store is a cesspool, the weather app switch was poorly executed, Google Podcasts went to the graveyard, and Google pay getting shut down meant I had to switch back to vomits Venmo.
I still have Android gaming handhelds, but why wouldn’t I just get an iPhone the next time I go to replace my phone? I can’t believe I’m even saying that after being so die hard Android so for years.
why wouldn’t I just get an iPhone
Jumping from the frying pan straight into the fire.
Exactly this. Just left iOS and got a pixel8a and flashed grapheneos on it. Apple is doing the same shit. GOS might be a pain in the ass sometimes but I feel much better knowing that Tim Apple isn’t reading my texts and monitoring my bank apps so they can target me with ads.
I feel much better knowing that Tim Apple isn’t reading my texts and monitoring my bank apps so they can target me with ads.
That’s some Grade A crack you’re smoking there, my dude.
I can’t do Graphene because of work. I am an IT manager, and one of our guys did graphene and had a host of issues with the work apps. I really can’t risk any issues.
This is the unfortunate hell I am in too. I’m debating an iPhone and I fucking hate Apple with a passion.
It sucks that at this point both systems suck. Apple is not great but at least it’s been pretty stable. If Apple allowed side loading that would be the dream.
Yeah, Apple is also a very proprietary ecosystem in a walled-garden style presentation. I don’t want an appliance. I want a computer.
It is a tough choice, both companies are gigantic and kind of scumbags. Funny story though, I was also in the market for a new computer recently as my 10 year old Windows 10 tower was really starting to show its age. My frustrations with Windows had also peaked.
I have been doing a more photo and video editing for fun, and I ended up taking a leap. I got an M4 Pro Mac mini. Mac OS is definitively better (IMO) for home use than Windows, and the M series processors are like wizardry. I liked it so much that shortly after I bought a used M2 Max MacBook Pro off of a coworker.
Coincidentally, a few months after I got my Macs LTT also switched over first to Snapdragon-based Windows laptops and later to Macs for a 30-day challenge and they ended up staying on the Macs.
I am an IT manager and I don’t think I would ever want to deploy Macs at scale in my workplace, though it is the only computer I look forward to using now.
Personally I’ll never purchase a Mac.
I have GrapheneOS for work, everything works fine. The only app that I had trouble with was the Westjet app, it needs a certain capatibily setting turned on and basically wants full access to the phone. Ironically the banking app was fine LOL
I’m sure we all have a different perception, but my current view is that Google sells you a phone that they need to push ads and harvest vast amounts of data from you in order to make money on the phone, and Apple somehow needs to do this less.
Which company do you feel takes privacy more seriously? From what I understand, Google primarily makes their money from advertising.
I’ve never owned an iPhone, but I 100% agree with you. The reason I choose android is because of the freedom to use my phone how i want (for the most part).
Apple is a walled garden, but their security is good, they’re not an advertising company in the same way google is and don’t have as much of an incentive to harvest and sell your data. If android is going to be a walled garden like iOS, I trust apple more than i do google and If in the future I can’t find a phone that has all the features i want anyway, then i may as well just get an iPhone.
Agreed across all points. Android’s main advantages after the changes go through with side loading will be:
- choice of manufacturer and
- the still-deeply-flawed-but-far-superior implementation of a work profile in Android.
I love being able to press one button and have all of my containerized work apps shut off. It is also quite nice that a remote wipe from M365 could be limited to the work app container rather than the entire phone.
They also managed to remove a feature from the fucking clock app. It’s not much, but seriously, it’s like a headless chicken running toward a cliff from the business end.
Google pay being shut down is news to me. I still pay contactless with Google pay and also for paying on websites…
Great. This could be just the boost that free android needs. Graphene and eos can brace for a few new customers i guess
I’ve been using graphene for a few months, but this latest news was what reminded me to start a monthly donation to the project. Hopefully Googles shenanigans push more people towards funding alternatives as well
I’ve gotta get a new phone soon (ol Pixel 3 is getting long in the tooth) and this is what I’m looking at too. I highly prefer the “default” Android UI, and the ability to install programs of my own choosing — but fuck Google, imagine getting locked out of your phone just because Google randomly unpersoned you.
Good luck and wisdom in choosing. I picked a fairphone and went for /e/os. No reason to regret that yet. Just does what it says on the tin
FYI: Apple got sued for blocking other app stores. This would prevent f-droid from being installable
f-droid would be verified right?
It’d be up to Google to do so, and they probably will just as an example of them totally not being a monopoly “look we even allowed a competing store”.
EU: How often do I have to teach you, old man?
EU is moving full steam ahead toward the end of “private” computers and mandatory state surveillance on your devices. They’ll be delighted with that. The funky “hey, we’re consumer friendly” times are over.
I honestly wish for the responsible people to die. A natural, painless death, but let it be quick. All of silicon valley is so evil it would be deemed unrealistic for a movie villain. They are selling out our freedoms and planet for what? They are already stinking rich.
Most moderate lemmy user when talking about digital freedom:
Moderates is what got us into this dystopia. We should have never tolerated greed and selfishness to begin with.
They are sexually aroused when they torture both individuals and society at large.
I wish I could accuse you of exaggerating. But I am not sure it is an exaggeration.
Everything is about sex. Sex is about power.
Only for toxic people.
I agree. One should strive to evolve beyond the tyranny of our amygdalas.
If you use the term “sideloading” you already lost the battle before you finished your sentence
I will pay hard cash money for some devs to bring postmarketos to quality hardware vendors.
I’m all for buying a pinephone, but man are we missing out on the full potential from some genuinely good OEM hardware stuff like razr flip.
Aside from google doing google things, android has been a bloated java pos toy OS for nearly a decade now. It completely wastes the full potential of superior hardware by running everything on a shitty JVM known as the ART that was designed for when devices had <512mb of RAM. A Nintendo 3DS can do better multi process tasking than modern android which regularly kills app threads for no reason other than to screw with you because you dared to switch to a different app for 5 seconds.
Android was supposed to be the big apple killer because of its closeness to a desktop OS with heavy emphasis on widespread features and functionality. Even technically speaking, rooting got you there if you wanted to run whatever straight on the linux environment or swap kernels.
Its nothing but a ripoff iOS clone now. Android 7/8 was probably the peak of development and usability, and even back then people were complaining it didn’t have groundbreaking improvements like 6 or lollipop.
I don’t think that it’s the lack of quality hardware what is stopping adoption of Linux on phones. There are many resons why I don’t consider someting like PostmarketOS viable as a daily driver for most.
First of all some apps are just not available on Linux. Banking apps are a prime example. Most banks are now requiring some form of app where I live and they don’t even consider Linux. But that’s also another problem in it self.
Secondly: driver support. Drivers aren’t something one thinks about when talking about phones. But they are needed and mobile phones being what they are, most manufacturers aren’t really open to do anything in that regard.
As an Android developer I’m also annoyed by the restrictive power management of Android. But it’s there for a reason. On PostmarketOS my phone would be dead after sitting around all day doing noting. On Android I can maybe squeeze two to three days of use out of the same phone. And that’s not even with the OEM rom.
That being said, I hope for a future were all of the current issues can be solved and we finally have a viable alternative to Apple and Google.
To be clear, I’m in no way trying to defend what Google is doing.
I honestly don’t care about apps. I switched to GrapheneOS and opted to not use Google Play Services, so my app selection is very limited, especially for things like banking apps. It turns out I can just use the website for the vast majority of them, and I can fill in the gaps with FDroid apps.
The main things stopping me from using a Linux phone (eg PostmarketOS) are:
- MMS compatibility - I use this a lot with family, and getting everyone on Signal or something isn’t going to happen
- battery efficiency - the best I’ve heard is 8 hours with light use, and there are still issues receiving notifications in standby mode
- hardware quality issues and drivers - every phone supported by PostmarketOS either has a bunch of unsupported hardware (ie no camera support), or the hardware is poor (ie the PinePhone has crappy audio)
I don’t need a flagship with top tier driver support, I just need basic phone things to work. I’m even okay with poor camera quality, provided I can take pictures of things and clearly read the text later. I don’t need much in terms of app support, and I’m willing to help port things I need. But my phone needs to work as a phone, and it needs to do so all day without needing to charge until night.
Yeah, I tried to use it as my daily driver a while back and what bugged me most was the terrible battery efficiency. Running the full desktop version of Firefox certainly didn’t help. At that point the camera also didn’t have any drivers. Since theres been some progress and we now have a work in progress driver for that model. Frankly it’s amazing that this works at all and I’m incredibly grateful for anyone working on this.
I’ve actually been rather lucky and managed to convince most of my friends to join me on Signal so we barely need to rely on SMS anymore. But last time I checked there weren’t any real Signal clients availabe for Linux phones. Of course, one could always use the desktop version but that still requires a phone to be linked to. Someone has managed to get the Matrix/Signal bridge working and rely on Matrix for the final delivery but that seems like too much tinkering for me :D
Don’t get me wrong, I think the work that’s been done is amazing, my point is that it’s still not daily driver ready. I want to help out, I just don’t have the time anymore with a full-time job and kids. If it was daily drive-able, I could probably spare a few hours here and there to improve things (port apps, track down bugs, etc).
I hope it gets there before I need a new phone. Last year I switched to a Pixel 8 for GrapheneOS and cut out most of my Google Play apps, so I should be good for a few years, but I’d very much like to ditch Android entirely next time.
For now, I got my SO to use Signal, but that’s it.
The only way to log into my bank on the website is to use the phone two factor authentication app, which only works with Google Play Services… 💩
I’m considering getting a dedicated login device which can sit on my desk all day doing nothing else.
Which 2FA app is that? I use Aegis (replaces Google Authenticator, available on FDroid) and Symantec VIP (from Google Play, but via Aurora and runs w/o Google Play Services). Is it something different?
In Sweden, all the major banks joined together and created BankId. It is now pretty much a monopoly on id verification. Even some government agencies use it, which is problematic for multiple reasons.
Debate by former PM: https://www.svd.se/a/y6VqmE/utredare-infor-statligt-bank-id
Edit: typos
Most of them don’t support generic 2FA codes and sadly require some sort of proprietary app that talks to their servers. Setting them up usually also requires some sort of identification; think receiving a pin in the post. As far as I can tell, the only other option for me is to rent some sort of pin generation terminal from the bank which is, of course, ridiculously expensive.
That sucks.
Unfortunately (or fortunately) banks here (US) generally only support SMS 2FA and occasionally support email, and a handful use the their app (but fall back to SMS).
I actually switched to Fidelity (a brokerage) as a primary bank because they were the only one I could find that supported real MFA using the Symantec VIP app, which fortunately works fine without Google Play Services.
