(I posted this comment in the other thread as well)
I banned all cellphones and computer-based note taking in the classroom, with the exception that students could use a device if they wrote with a stylus.
I get the cell phones, for most classes you won’t need to have it out aside from taking an occasional photo of diagrams.
However, I’ve always thought that it was silly to have this stance on computers. Not everyone has access to an iPad or nice Wacom device, nor stylus compatible software that matches their workflow / note-taking style. I tried a lot of them and never found one I liked.
The article cites that same decade-old paper, which suggests that handwritten notes have better retention. If you actually look at the paper, here is the design of the commonly cited study:
Students generally participated 2 at a time, though some completed the study alone. The room was preset with either laptops or notebooks, according to condition. Lectures were projected onto a screen at the front of the room. Participants were instructed to use their normal classroom note-taking strategy, because experimenters were interested in how information was actually recorded in class lectures. The experimenter left the room while the lecture played.
Next, participants were taken to a lab; they completed two 5-min distractor tasks and engaged in a taxing working memory task (viz., a reading span task; […]). At this point, approxi- mately 30 min had elapsed since the end of the lecture. Finally, participants responded to both factual-recall questions (e.g., “Approximately how many years ago did the Indus civilization exist?”) and conceptual-application questions (e.g., “How do Japan and Sweden differ in their approaches to equality within their societies?”) about the lecture and completed demographic measures.
The advantage of typed notes is being able to reformat the notes over time and to go back and fill in details after class. If students don’t get the opportunity to do that, then yes it makes sense that the more cognitively demanding method of taking notes would give better recall.
This also depends a lot on the type of course being taught, which I didn’t see when I skimmed the NYT article:
I’ve taught the same course to a class of undergraduate, M.B.A., medical and nursing students every year for over a decade
What’s true is that laptops can be distracting to other students around you if you are doing something else (ex. watching sports / e-sports was common). If profs want to reduce that without policing what people are doing in class, having a “laptop section” in a back corner of the classroom works nicely
I don’t know about you, but I rarely referred to my notes later. The lectures frequently corresponded to the textbook, so I’d review the textbook again in light of what the lecture covered.
For me, handwritten notes were much more effective than digital notes because I rarely actually used the notes and taking notes was more to keep my attention on the speaker than actually recording the lecture.
Everyone works differently of course, I’m just pointing out that my experience was close to what the studies measured.
I exclusively wrote everything down with a pen, since I was not going to bring a laptop everywhere and somehow get it to stay powered for so many hours. Not to mention that it would have been terrible to draw schematics etc.
The best were those courses where you could prepare a “cheat sheet”, so then I go over everything and put key information and formulas into a word document. So I go over my notes, then have to filter them and then write the key things again. Maximum retention, as I can tell you 10 years later.
I don’t care. Mostly because we already have examples of what classes were like without them and the people who are reliant on them now will adapt and learn to cope if they’re taken away.
Additionally, people only think about what phones could be used for in class that they’d disapprove of, rather than things it might actually be useful for. I’ve personally had great success with recording lessons/lectures, and being able to refer back to them. This allowed me to ask more questions and take more time to understand the subject. Taking photos of diagrams? Awesome. Having a note document that I could reformat that was legible? Awesome.
I’m getting old, but when I retire, I’m going to go to as many free post secondary classes as I’m able, having never been to pist secondary, and never being a good student (I was mediocre at best and was smart enough to pass, without doing much of the work. I do not recommend or endorse being me as I was in school)
I really am curious what and how people use modern devices to great effect for studying/learning.
The world is so much different than in my youth it fascinates me what modern good study habits exist now. Like what’s the modern equivalent to flash cards? There has be something technologically amazing right? Even if it’s not well known to be widely adopted.
One thing that worked for me was recording the lesson so that I didn’t necessarily have to take notes right away and could absorb more information being told to me, have time to think about that information and ask questions in the moment. Then I could go home, re-listen to the lecture, write out some notes, and then fine tune those notes by reading the source material and other learning aids. This worked better for me especially having ADHD than trying to write notes and missing parts of the lecture as a result. Being able to take photos of the board was also useful, especially when diagrams and or visual information was being relayed.
I do think it’s important to experiment with what you have available and find strategies that work for you. Not everyone learns the same way.
I love gadgets. So it’s like what will people have come up with by the time I retire. And I have absolutely loved stationary. I don’t know why. It could easily be a problem.
Studying, in its base form, follows these steps:
-take in the information
-record the information
-review the information you’ve recorded in chunks. Best practice is to review your newly recorded information at the end of the session, and at the start of the next session review old information. If you can review ALL your recorded information on a subject at the start of a new session that’s best - at first it’s slow but as you review a couple times you’re skimming or skipping most of it and only focus on the parts that you have trouble retaining.
With that being said, the ways we prefer to TAKE IN and RECORD information vary between people, but the overall concept does not.
In terms of flash cards, they’re great for memorization. That has not changed - it’s a base way to record and review information.
A modern version of this applies the base method but digitizes it. Anki is a very good and popular modern flash card app/program
-you can make flash cards with text, but also audio, images, and video
-you can save decks and sync them across all devices and share/upload decks
-it’s “smart.” If you spend more time struggling to answer a card, or get it wrong, it’ll show it to you more frequently. The reverse is true if you get it right every time quickly, you see it much less frequently
-it can nag you to study. You can set it up to notify you every hour, day, whatever and thrust 10-1000 cards in your face, whatever you set it to.
-tons of ways to configure it so it meets your specific needs.
So, that’s how things have modernized, for flash cards at least. But plenty of people still buy 3x5 index cards and keep a physical deck if that’s what they prefer. Again, the method isn’t as important as the process of receive/record/review.
Personally I like to use an e-ink handwriting tablet for in person note taking (all the benefits of paper/handwriting without the fuss of paper, plus lots of other features like cut/paste, linking/bookmarking items, etc) and I prefer typing into a word document when I’m studying from a book. The word document is very clean and I can use structured outlining formatting as well as a quick Ctrl+f to find terms I’ve written about. But whether it’s e-ink tablet or word doc, the base method is the same as when I was younger and it was all paper.
I think phones have their uses but they are awful for note taking. The fastest texter is much slower than writing by hand or typing, and you are so, so much more limited in underlining, highlighting, little symbols, positioning text in weird ways to symbolize things, etc. I don’t advocate that people use them unless they’re in a bind and have nothing else, but a lot of kids grow up these days and that’s their go to method because of familiarity, and we shouldn’t encourage that because it’s flat worse. However, phones can do great things such as record/transcribe, photos, videos etc - so they’re a great addition to the toolbox, but they’re not a NOTE TAKING replacement unless they’re a stylus/handwriting type, and even those are a poor cousin to a dedicated device for the purpose, but they can be a more affordable/versatile/portable version. My note writer was about $500 and that’s a lot of cheese but it was worth every penny to me because of how I use it.
Stawwp. Staaaaawwp! I’m not retiring yet! (Though I will shamelessly accept many and or large donations to start right now, it’s probably less than you think)
There’s a lot of comments about how digital devices are viable/helpful for note-taking and just as good as a pen. I think that’s missing the crucial point: virtually every device we own today is designed as a distraction machine.
A pen + paper isn’t going have any notifications or reminders or updates or emails or texts or ads or alarms or alerts. If there’s any device without those that’s as reliable and as cheap as a notebook, I’ve never heard of it.
Putting a device on airplane mode removes the distractions. If I play a video game while the lecture is going on, well that is on me, or the lecture, or both.
My issue is that I type faster than I write. I think instead they should push for something like audio/memo recorders.
One of the points in the article described how being slower to hand write makes you think about what you write before doing so, which leaves you with more meaningful notes instead of a transcript.
That’s not how I take notes. I usually end up panicking that I’m not getting everything I want and ultimately give up. I do the same thing trying to take notes playing D&D to this day.
😂😂😂😂 I don’t think so . Just anxiety to have it back
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hey. it occurs to me too late that you might have taken exception to the tone of my previous remark. i had intended it to be genuinely helpful but im afraid it came out as world weary and, well, a little unpleasant. and i didn’t actually offer you any recovery resource. I just basically said “you got a problem lol gl” which is an enormous dickhead move in retrospect.
here. check out https://smartrecovery.org/
it’s a science-based alternative to the twelve step programs you might be hesitant to join due to their religious infuence. they have lots of in-person meetings and online too. i personally get more value out of in-person but everyone has their own preference and it’s nice to be able to make a meeting wherever I am.
the general philosophy can be summed up, “you have a choice.” it teaches that unpleasant emotions like anxiety are generally transient and offers strategies for coping with urges and building a balanced lifestyle. it offers a toolkit and an adaptable method.
it does focus generally speaking on substance addiction, but recognizes that addiction takes many forms. sex addiction, gambling, shopping, intimacy, trichotillomania, and yes, phone addiction. the most recent addiction to our meeting group is a young trans woman who struggles with self-harm urges. addiction is not something to be ashamed of, and it’s more common than you think.
please check it out. you don’t have to live in service to that anxiety.
