Shameful
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We are part of a genocide… i can’t believe our government approves this…
I can believe it.
German people in power dont do a genocide, challenge level: IMPOSSIBLE.
tho tbf it seema most other governments in eu have this brain bug as well. Bibi really got the boomers in a stranglehold
Vorsprung Durch Vernichtung
Vorteil durch Selbstzerstörung
> Gives Israel a billion dollars, because they’re so sorry.
> Still elects Nazis.
Edit: Although, Jesus, people are big mad at them in here. Russia and “Belarus” are still the problem, and Germany is still a valuable member of the EU.
Jesus, you are a prolific (“big, very big”) troll for normalizing putler alone – and especially so when normalizing putler’s Russia in comparison to an EU member state. No shame, no clues. Yet - thousands of posts. Omg.
Did you reply to the wrong person?
If not, the edit should make it pretty clear I’m not siding with Russia.
Germany always manages to be on the wrong side of history
I think Germany has a special relationship with “whiteness” that makes it especially vulnerable to fascism, especially in how Germany is perceived and treated by other groups of white people.
Also though, Germany is a culture bursting with contradictions, within a year of Mein Kempf being published another novel was published The Magic Mountain by Thomas Mann by an originally German author who moved to the US.
The Magic Mountain is firmly cemented in German culture… and is indisputably one of the best novels ever written in German or English and is certainly one of the most humanist and openly accepting of humanity in all its “failures” of any great novel of the 20th century. The Magic Mountain is the most supremely antifascist novel imaginable and it is equally allergic to racism and discrimination.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Mann
With the start of the Cold War, he was increasingly frustrated by rising McCarthyism. As a “suspected communist”, he was required to testify to the House Un-American Activities Committee, where he was termed “one of the world’s foremost apologists for Stalin and company”.[19] He was listed by HUAC as being “affiliated with various peace organizations or Communist fronts”.
Being in his own words a non-communist, rather than an anti-communist, Mann openly opposed the allegations: “As an American citizen of German birth, I finally testify that I am painfully familiar with certain political trends. Spiritual intolerance, political inquisitions, and declining legal security, and all this in the name of an alleged ‘state of emergency’. … That is how it started in Germany.”
As Mann joined protests against the jailing of the Hollywood Ten and the firing of schoolteachers suspected of being Communists, he found “the media had been closed to him”.[20] Finally, he was forced to quit his position as Consultant in Germanic Literature at the Library of Congress,[21] and in 1952, he returned to Europe, to live in Kilchberg, near Zürich, Switzerland. Here he initially lived in a rented house and bought his last house there in 1954 (which later his widow and then their son Golo lived in until their deaths).
He never again lived in Germany, though he regularly traveled there. His most important German visit was in 1949, at the 200th birthday of Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, attending celebrations in Frankfurt am Main (then West Germany) and Weimar (then East Germany), as a statement that German culture extended beyond the new political borders.[22] He also visited Lübeck, where he saw his parents’ house, which was partially destroyed by the bombing of Lübeck in World War II (and only later rebuilt).
History is a nightmare from which we are trying to awake.
I think Germany has a special relationship with “whiteness”
No that’s the US. Racism in Germany and Europe as a whole, has always been about cultural and ethnic differences more than skin color. The persecuted slavs or jews were just as pasty as any German, unlike the “honorary Aryans” in Japan.
Germany is a culture bursting with contradictions, within a year of Mein Kempf being published another novel was published The Magic Mountain by Thomas Mann
Two different authors with different backgrounds writing different books? What a uniquely contradictory culture Germany is.
Disregard that one of them is lauded for its literary and cultural significance while the other is basically as important as the art of the deal.And of course the explanation for contemporary German culture and its problematic relation to Israel can be found in the literature of 1924.
Nothing significant happened since then, right? Everyone was on vacation in the 30s and 40s. Occupation, the Cold War, the literal formation of the country of Israel? Surely none of the could have any relevance.I do agree that the Magic Mountain is a great book.
But although some of its themes do go against aspects of fascism, calling it "the most supremely antifascist novel imaginable " seems a bit of a stretch.No that’s the US. Racism in Germany and Europe as a whole, has always been about cultural and ethnic differences more than skin color. The persecuted slavs or jews were just as pasty as any German, unlike the “honorary Aryans” in Japan.
ahahahaha
Read The Color Purple or Their Eyes Were Watching God, the idea that racism actually cares about skin tone in any consistent way anywhere is impossible, contradictory and absurd, it is always mixed up with ethnicity, context and imposed categories. Germany is just the same as any other racist society in that respect. Check your ignorance.
You added nothing to this conversation other than a sense of condescencion.
The Magic Mountain is one of the most supremely antifascist novels ever written and its perspective from the eve of WW1 mirrors our current position with eerie and foreboding syncronicity. The Magic Mountain is easily one of the most important novels of the 20th century, if not all time.
In 1933, when Hitler came to power, Mann moved his own family to Switzerland, and then, after his German citizenship was revoked, to the USA, where he recorded monthly anti-fascist dispatches which were broadcast to Germany by the BBC.
He is ‘one of the great German writers’, wrote Malcolm Bradbury, ‘the spokesman for a modern humanism’.
https://henryeliot.substack.com/p/the-magic-mountain
Come up with a better argument if you want to cut me down.
Read The Color Purple or Their Eyes Were Watching God
Do they contain sociological studies that support your claim that
Germany has a special relationship with "whiteness”
Otherwise I don’t see what you think this is adding to the conversation.
As for The Magic Mountain:
its perspective from the eve of WW1 mirrors our current position
We currently don’t have European empires in a mutual standoff waiting for the powder-keg to be lit. By all accounts most people are more reminded of the inter-war period with the rising fascism.
The Magic Mountain is easily one of the most important novels of the 20th century
I never disagreed but being important does not automatically make it anti-fascist.
In 1933, when Hitler came to power, Mann moved his own family to Switzerland
And just like his cold war experiences that you quoted before, this happened after he published Zauberberg in 1924.
At the time, Mussolini’s regime had barely begun and Hitler was a failed putschist in jail.Come up with a better argument if you want to cut me down.
Dude, your only “arguments” are wikipedia quotes about Mann’s life after he published the book, completely unrelated literature recommendations and an unexplained association of fascism with the eve of WWI.
I honestly find it hilarious you don’t think The Magic Mountain is one of the most antifascist novels ever written, and one of the most effective and wholistic takedowns of fascism ever created in any form ever… your understanding of history must be so mutilated into discrete bloody boxes one preceding after another with no connection between one and another…
Six months later, Mann resumed work on the novel he had begun before the war: The Magic Mountain. His development and completion of the manuscript occurred in tandem with a dramatic political reorientation: deeply shaken by the assassination of Foreign Minister Walter Rathenau in 1922, Mann took a decisive stand in defense of the fragile, embattled Weimar Republic. In his essays and speeches of the second half of the 1920s, he continued to warn Germans of the threat posed by the National Socialist Party. Had he not left Germany when he did, it is very likely that he would have been arrested and interned in the Dachau concentration camp.
your understanding of history must be so mutilated
I beg you to open a history book and look up when the rise of fascism happened.
In 1924 the NSDAP was a bunch of violent thugs pretending to be socialists. Their rise to power happened a decade later. The only fascist was Mussolini and he had not yet fully implemented all that we nowadays call fascism.You have not made one single argument that actually ties anything in the book to fascism.
You keep quoting articles about Mann’s later life but the only reference you made to the book itself was mentioning the eve of WWI which at least time-wise sets the action before the rise of fascism.You have not identified one anti-fascist theme in the book nor quoted any literary analysis that does so.
If you desperately want to make this argument, then you have to ask yourself:
What is fascism? What are its defining characteristics? Where does the book address them?
And which themes are specific to fascism? Contemplating mortality as such is not.You have not made one single argument that actually ties anything in the book to fascism.
So you did not bother to read the article I linked before responding?
Yes I have.
History is a nightmare from which we are trying to awake.
This comment is so true.
It’s only the wrong side if you lose.
@HieroProtagonist @blackshirt
That has traditionally been the case because the historical account was the exclusive copyright of the “winner”.
Now, however (as we can see e.g. with Israel’s century of terrorism and crimes against humanity), the truth is harder to hide.
#Germany is on the wrong side of history, and that won’t change, whoever “wins”.And do you see any sign of a downfall of those who are on the - in your opinion - “wrong side”?
Sooo…
Germany is giving israel weapons to exterminate Palestinians
5D chess
multiple autosomal and uniparental studies find close overlap between Palestinians and regional Jewish groups
Palestinians are finally paying the price for 80 years of bad political decisions at every turn that have lead them to this point. The chickens have come home to roost. The bill has come due. Karma is a bitch. Time to pay the piper. Pick your metaphor. Eventually one’s bad decisions catch up with them… true of individuals, true for nations of people as well.
Psychopath. The same can be said for Israel because they’ve lost most of the world’s support, and they’ll be losing the US next.
Cant wait for your turn, twat
Attacking Palestinians with submarines?
Submarines was not the only things included in this. Why should you have a settler colonial power doing genocide in any shape or form anyway
The naval blockage of Gaza is part of the genocide, so yeah pretty much.
That is also not enforced with submarines.
It is enforced with Israeli naval superiority, of which submarines contribute to.
What do you mean, are saying Israel doesn’t use submarines? Who told you that?
You better believe they have them even if you aren’t aware of their use in sinking shipping.
I’m saying they are not using them in any blockade. Or are there reports to the contrary?
Don’t comment if you’re not going to even open the article first
Berlin also approved licenses to export military equipment to Tel Aviv, including small arms, ammunition, explosives, and unmanned aerial vehicles.
I have, and the large increase in value, the whole reason for the article, hence the very large picture at the top, is the submarine deal, which is the relevant new thing.
And witholding weapons from Ukraine.
Yes
Can’t make this shit up. Germany needs a better army because Russia is actively attacking it, so what do they do? Sell their shit to Israel.
Also all russia can really threaten Europe and Germany with are ballistic missiles and who was it again who launched a war THEY KNEW would consume all of Europe’s ballistic missile interceptors?
Actually that is one of the best arguments for selling arms to Israel. Germany bought Arrow from them, which is perfect against Russian longer range missiles. Nobody in Europe produces a system with similar capabilities and the only alternatives to that are being sold by the US, Russia and China.
As for Patriot interceptors, those are used by the US and Arab countries. Israel has a system called Davids Sling, which has similar capabilities. They actually sold that to Finland and Greece. Currently Volkswagen is in talks with Israel to produce parts of that in Germany. That would be a useful factory to have in case of a war with Russia.
Also no European country has send missile interceptors to Israel or any country in the region. The most are shooting down some Iranian drones attacking Cyprus, but that is to be expected.
I’m not convinced of the utility of Patriot/David’s Sling in modern warfare. In the early phase of the 2026 Israel/USA-Iran war, Iran was shooting about a dozen missiles per night at Israel, and there’s good indication that a substantial amount got through. Of the (admittedly limited) number of videos that leaked out of Israel, Iranian rockets were often not even met by interceptor fire at all; some videos show how infrastructure get hit during daytime while no sirens are on; and in the cases that there was successful interception the kill rate appears to be less than 1/3.
Without speculating too much, it appears that these systems are not suitable for neutralizing hypersonic missiles. Further, they’re useless against cluster munitions, and using them on attack drones is a waste. Shahed-136 is getting a range extension and a 3x speed boost by the way.
Conclusion: Israeli weaponry is shit. It’s good for fighting asymmetric warfare when you’re the overwhelmingly stronger party. It’s great taking makeshift rockets made by an underground guerilla out of the sky. Against a real country, it’s a flawed doctrine and an impossible technology.
If the USA can’t defend their bases against Iran, then what exactly is the use of these missile interceptors against an enemy like Russia?
So maybe use those billions of Euros at home developing a real strategy.
I see a massive modern war in Ukraine, where Ukraine is fighting for survival. The number one system they want are missile interceptors like Patriot. They spend a lot of money and political capital on getting them. More then on any other system.
Russia is surely watching what is happening on both sides of the Atlantic closely. Moscow knows that it is also subject to the laws of physics when it comes to its own munitions depth, but it understands the politics of scarcity. If US intelligence assessments are right that Putin plans to “test NATO resolve” in the coming years, then the replenishment clock matters on both sides—and Russia is trying to recapitalize itself while fighting a full-scale war.
One of the reasons for Ratcliffe’s visit to Moscow, according to the Washington Post, was to dispel the Kremlin’s belief that the Trump White House was distracted from Ukraine by Iran. Good luck with that. The reporting on the severe depletion of US interceptor stocks from the war on Iran is so extensive it can only have encouraged Vladimir Putin to launch even more deadly missile strikes against Ukraine’s defenseless population.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/sep/03/ukraine-iran-wars-trump
Have you read the first article?
Quote by you:
who was it again who launched a war THEY KNEW would consume all of Europe’s ballistic missile interceptors?
From the first article:
Germany has donated about one-third of its Patriot systems to Ukraine,
Oh and also from the article:
Israel is a unique case in the region but faces similar constraints. Its indigenous missile defense capabilities—including Arrow 3, Arrow 2, and David’s Sling—give it options that other US partners in the region do not have.
In other words Israel can build missile interceptors.
And then you even quote the article:
If US intelligence assessments are right that Putin plans to “test NATO resolve” in the coming years, then the replenishment clock matters on both sides
In other words, being able to access more interceptors is a key thing for European NATO members. Israel can make more of those.
Oh and this is from the US, who stopped Patriot missile sales to Ukraine BEFORE the war against Iran for months, because Zelensky did not war a suit. I would not be surprised if US stockpiles do not matter in a war at all, because the US is unwilling to sell them to Europe. That obviously would make Israel an even more important option.
Yes I did read the article and no, none of your points establish that Israel is an ally of Europe or Ukraine, you have only established that Israel has increased political leverage of them.
Oh and this is from the US, who stopped Patriot missile sales to Ukraine BEFORE the war against Iran for months,
The US and Israel planned the Iran War at least months in advance? This proves nothing.
Israel has supplied Ukraine with air defence interceptors last year. That was months after the the US halted all military aid to Ukraine.
A SINGLE PATRIOT SYSTEM does not make up for all the missiles fired in the war of choice that is the Iran War, that Israel and the US chose to start arbitrarily.
a system called Davids Sling
Forever want to be seen as a David vs Goliath.
Goliath was probably 6ft 9in. Israelite culture was derived from Canaanite / Philistine culture, and genetically they’re mostly indistinguishable. The native populations did mostly convert to Greek gods, Roman, then Christianity and Islam.
The Israeli invaders are mainly Hasidic and Ashkenazi Jews who are Caucasian Ukrainian and European in descent.
Germany is guilt trapped in relation to Israel, it’s sad how much they get taken advantage off
Its because if we really thought about the issue, and accept that Isreal was a racist bit of leibensraum to kick the Jews out of Europe, a big chunk of those Israelis should probably be repatriated to Germany.
And they don’t want that. That’s why Germany is such a pushover.
A quick reminder that Russia’s attack on Europe is decisively supported by China.
Although Ukraine also buys all their drone components from China.
Really, they’re just sitting back and making a profit.
How do you know?
China’s already won the war against the west.
They don’t care.China can’t even complete their silk road. All they are winning at is price dumping and ramming fishing boats. Meanwhile, their demographics are even worse than the West and irreversibly so.
Temu and others disagree.
I did mention price dumping in my comment.
Look I know China personally about as you do and I can tell you one thing: they don’t want any war. They just want to be the centre of the world again and make every nation economically dependent on them. War doesn’t help them, because they win with economy.
You do know what happens to the economy of countries that go to war, right?
By your own argument, China should be giddy about everyone else going to war.
Not really, you present your argument as a false equivalence. Math equation:
(Blooming economy without loss of life) > (Temporary economic boom caused by war, resulting in loss of life, risk of losing power, post war inflation and needing to rebuild infrastructure to allow for the continuation of blooming economy without loss of life)
China want buyers for things that aren’t just weapons. They prefer using the weapons for themselves to threaten other countries in the eastern Asian seas
I wouldn’t give Israel even one helmet, but I don’t think Germany is actually short on submarines.
WTF are you doing Germany? up to your old tricks i see
They’re trying to master the race to the bottom.
Rich ppl making money is a universal threat to all nations.
Israel commits genocide.
So does germany.
So they got support from the experts.
Using today’s definition of “genocide” per UN, even Canada commits genocide, and HAMAS for that matter.
Neither Hamas and Canada are destroying 70% of other people infrastructures and are currently creating a famine by bombing 85% of the agricultural field .
Hamas eliminates 100% of palestinians who are deemed not to support hamas. Hamas has even been killing the members of a competing party/paramilitary, Fatah. Or other palestinians, who hope to coexist with Israel. Or only are believed to be neutral to the neighbouring country.
And hamas certainly eliminates each and every palestinian who is suspected to be helping to locate and free any israeli, captured by hamas.
Yup. Other than that, hamas is so very good and perfectly nice. “Why so serious?” /s
Israel is doing every single goddamn atrocities Hamas did for 78 goddamn year . Don’t claim that you care about any Palestinians when you support the side doing the genocide
I would only suggest or expect, that you (as well as any other person) to stop lying and putting your own words into others’ mouth. But in the end it’s your choice - and your responsibility. And you’ve just lied 💁
And I certainly keep considering any life as precious and sacred - especially of those, who have little chances of vocalising their peaceful humane believes (like palestinians in the hands of the ruthless hamas paramilitaries - or protesting citizens inside putler’s Russia). That is my choice - NOT your barbaric claims.
Everybody is lying except supporter of settler colonialism like you. I oppose hamas atrocities and israel atrocities .
Colonizers in the West Bank are burning homes, beating up the elderly, and attacking livestock. Israel built the colonies, put the colonizers on the land, armed the colonizers, and protects them when they commit their acts of terrorism
The barbaric rhetoric comes from you
I don’t - and can’t - take any of your claims - as i have just noted how you are lying when presenting your barbaric ideas for my believes.
It’s nice that at least you’re trying to claim to oppose atrocities
- but yeah, these are your claims. So it could be lies, again.
It doesn’t matter, the definition stands (per UN).
All of Jerusalem was burned to the ground by the Romans, so they could say they’ve lost 100% of their infrastructure and agricultural fields, and they are only taking back what was theirs. They want to own all of the land from “The River to the Sea”.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Jerusalem_(70_CE)
HAMAS is dedicated to their destruction, and also wants to own everything from “The River to the Sea”. They are losing right now.
Canada is also genocidal, per UN, for putting native children in indoctrination camps and warring in Iraq with the USA (just off top of head).
Just a head’s up, genocide isn’t “70% of infrastructure” and “85% of agricultural fields”, it’s not even murder per definition.
Why should Palestinians pay for what the roman did to the jews?
The definition show that Israel is committing genocide. Hamas may have genocidal statement but they are not committing one right now .
Just a head’s up, genocide isn’t “70% of infrastructure” and “85% of agricultural fields”, it’s not even murder per definition.
The intent to destroy a population partially or fully fit the definition of genocide. The destruction of agricultural fields cause famine and would force Palestinians to be ethnically cleansed or dying from starvation
You are claiming that all the land belong to israel forever , so you are basically supporting the genocide of Palestinians . East Jerusalem and west bank which Israel is colonizing is Palestinians not Israel.
In his book The Land of Israel in the Past and Present Ben gurion said : the local Palestinian agricultural workers (the Fellahin) were actually the direct descendants of the ancient Jewish and Samaritan farmers who had remained on the land after the Roman expulsions.
Palestinians are basically Israelites that converted to Islam and was Arabized
Would be much cooler if they also sold 2 billion dollars worth of arms exports to their neighborsto keep everyone happy…
Ffs Germany, why do you do this
I mean… you don’t think they feel a little guilty about what they’ve done to Jewish people in the past?
No, i don’t think so. Black people also suffered from german empires you don’t see germany defending for example the rsf
I mean fair point but you only really hear about the Jewish victims. Of course there were others as well but most of the things I’ve seen about the holocaust focus on Germany and Jewish people.
That’s the thing: the holocaust was not Germany’s only genocide. People only focus on the holocaust because it’s still technically in living memory and because Germany had streamlined its techniques to the point that they were able to commit genocide on a scale the world wasn’t expecting.
Wow I had no idea. Only about 100 years ago too.
The international public was always much more concerned about the Jews, that is obviously going to shape the German perception about what they should feel guilty about.
Should i mention all the terrorists attack the Zionists did that target other jews? Did germany condemned israel bombing a synagogues in Iran?
I’m talking about the public perception, not whether it’s justified by facts.
62% of German voters believe that Israel’s military actions in Gaza constitute genocide
OK? I’m not disputing that. But I’m talking about history and the international public opinion, especially international public opinion in the decades immediately after WW2, not the opinion of the German population or the fact that it’s pretty easy to argue that Israel itself is antisemitic.
Pretty fucking dumb to endorse Genocide to the tune of ~1 billion because of guilt about conducting a Genocide…
It is dumb, yes, but humans aren’t always rational about such emotionally intense things as that scale of national guilt
No, this is an extremely rational colonialist decision made big German business interests.
The rational being selling stuff gives you money, i dont think they really care who dies, as long as there is someone left to be their customer.
I am from the USA so that is a totally, utterly perposterous idea to me, my bad I didn’t realize Europe is so much less civilized than USA.
steps on a rake and hits self in face
I didn’t say it was a smart decision. Emotions can make people do irrational things. And if they feel that badly about what happened in the past, I could see this hard overcorrection.
Afd seem to be set for election, so, no?
Thank you for your insight on the German psyche, Adolf Schmitler.
o7
They ain’t exactly rushing to defend transsexual people worldwide. Way more than just Jewish people were killed in the Holocaust. They only feel guilty about the Jewish ones?
Israel claims that only Jews were victims of the Holocaust.
Nope, never said or even implied that but whatever makes you feel good posting I guess
Not just any exports. Includes a nuclear launch capable submarine for one of the 4 countries not party to the non proliferation treaty. Good stuff
Wrong
